The situation in Afghanistan is intensifying. Record coalition troop deaths in June. Tumult and transition among the war's leadership. Another Taliban attack, this time on the Jalalabad airport.
Last week, Gen. David Petraeus told CNN that he supports President Barack Obama's July 2011 deadline to start withdrawing U.S. troops from Afghanistan, a key point of contention between the president and many of his Republican critics in Congress.
What do you think? Will the U.S. meet the July 2011 date? How do you think the government should define success? How would you define success in Afghanistan?
Every action has re-action. Torture = torture Killing = killing air boming = IEDs
Read this, guys.
Marine Corps in Afghanistan will soon be Dead Corps of soldiers.
You sure don't think much of our Military!!! The way we are doing it will make a big difference...
The only way to peace is US withdrawal from Afgh. First US considered Alqaeda as the enemy and went to afgh to fight them. Now US considers taliban as the main enemy and are fighting them. With time, other war lords and tribes have started fighting along with taliban against US. Now US has no clear strategy; they know they have lost it but how to avoid embarrassment it the point now. US should move out of afgh as soon as possible and try not to meddle in affairs of the whole world.
We will by the end of next year!!!
This country can only be won if we stop this idea of making the country like us. Unlike IRAQ afghanistan fails in the knowledge needed to understand what we are doing for them. In Iraq the citizens had tvs/ computers in their house hold and could see what it was like to be free and not fall to a tyrant.. In afghanistan most of the people have little knowledge and do not even know what a tv or internet is so all they know is their farm and family. This country has known nothing but war so why would they believe another occupier They know no better. We need to tighten up our military hit key points in a mass and be highly mobile. We need to be able to attack precise points of which our military has deemed necessities and let soldiers do their jobs FIGHT A WAR not be peace keepers.
We are not trying to change them like us... We are just trying to make it so that they can take care of themselves!!!
The only reason now to hold position in Afghanistan should be the fact that it has a lot of natural resources which US can use. Apart from that forget about teaching/bringing those people to normalcy. We should understand the history of that place and the culture of those people. They just do not value life, what can you do them. Well today they are fighting against foreigners (US), tomorrow they will kill their own people, radicalize and just go on... for them that is the way of life... so just forget about improving scene over there.... we should always remember that some things on earth are just irreparable... So, in my opinion US should have just enough military establishment so that they can use the resources in future, plus hold strategic places against China and Pakistan... I strongly believe what Afghanistan has done to US today, Pakistan will be the major head ache to world peace in the times to come... some countries are just f****d up.... there is no way to fix them...
The problem is we didn't know about it when we got involved there!!! Maybe if the Republicans had control it would be true... But the Democrats want to get our troops out of both wars!!!
US military presence in AFghanistan has insecured the region. Before US occupatio of Afghanistan, the tribal areas of Pakistan were safe place and there was no extremism, but today it is the most dangerous place on the earth.
what a joke.... tribal regions of Pakistan were safe...???? for whom ??? the terrorists....
It was a safe place, if became messed up after the forces came.
Who Cares: Who's forces are you referring to Ghengis Khan's?
That isn't true!!! They are cleaning the Tarriest out of Pakistan... The most dangerous place is Iran!!!
Where is WMD in Iraq, did u find it??
If u want to get rid of Afghanistan, build a strong army and double the number of graduates of every monht. If US leave Afghanistan, insurgents will begin nogotiating the Afghan government, and from other side if they want to continue fight, some people will not support them like today.
Why do you think we are training the Military and Police to take care of themselves!!!
The war in Afghanistan is different, but shown different to American public. Come see in Afghanistan what is really happening. Only in Kurangal Valley of Kunar province, 11 choppers were hit and took down since 2001. If in one valley that much casualties, how much casualties would be there in all over Afghanistan. You guess!
I totally believe what you are saying! I do not know why some Americans see the war through rose colored glasses. our media has been hijacked by the so called republican party and the money backers behind them. All led by Fox News Network. they have systematically instated racist thoughts into their followers heads. it is insane over here! we have to work hard to find unbiased media in america right now. But please don't despair, there are Americans who know what this war is all about and HATE IT EVERYDAY!
And there are some that hold the opposite view just let the dice roll.
The reason there is more People dieing there is because the fighting is there!!! That doesn't mean anyone is dieing any other part of the Country...
NASER IF YOU ARE WRITING THE TRUTH KEEP ON. IT IS IMPORTANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH. NO BODY WANTS TO SEND YOUNG CHILDREN IF NO ONE CAN HAVE THE FREEDOM FROM THE EVIL SOONER OR LATER
Leave the country, else all US tropps will die in Afghanistan. As we saw since 2001, the casualites number is going up every year, not down. So, in 2011 more troops will die.
When you put more troops in of course there would be more People killed!!! It doesn't mean we are losing the war...
Even a quick glimpse at a history book will reveal that there is no happy ending for any military intervention/invasion of Afghanistan from the time of Genghis Khan to the present . There are only two possible "win" scenarios Kill them all or get out and leave them alone. Since the USA is not going to pursue the first course, I would suggest the second with all possible speed.
That was because they tried to take over the Country... Not like us training them to take care of themselves!!!
Why are you repeating what he said???
Larry: I didn't repeat what he said i pointed out the link between Islam and modern day slavery in northern Africa.
I'm concerned that we aren't doing enough to address the reason(s) why we're in Afghanistan in the first place. One of those reasons is because of Al Qaeda and one reason they stated for the 9/11 attacks was because of our favoritism toward Israel. I know it's not politically popular to criticize or otherwise question Israel, but we must change our posture on supporting Zionism if we ever wish to have peace with our Muslim brothers. Both fanatical Muslims and fanatical Jews are the reason we are in Afghanistan. We need to work on both.
You really aren't stupid enough to think the United States is keeping the PEACE there do you??? I hate to tell you it is because of Israel!!!
Right get rid of the Muslin and the Republicans and you are curred of the cancer!!!
The only possible success is TO LEAVE RIGHT NOW. This is war is illegal, immoral and a waste of money and lives.
Would you say that about WWII too??? Wars stops the Enemy from taking over your Country!!! I guess you rather have Hitler running this Country rather than Obama??? He would have probably killed your Family too and you wouldn't be here today!!!
You are right to link Islam and slavery, which is still happening today in the 21st century.
The United States still has slavery!!! Because they use Illegals to keep the wages down...
It seems like you hate Islam almost as much as Obama does.Have you ever read the Coran?
Do you know how to spell? coran! good grief.
NUKE THEM BACK TO THE STONE AGE
What did Israel over do to you???
Here's another shining example of this right-wing lynch-mob mentality!!!
I giggled like a silly girl when i typed that i just couldn't help myself.
This war is so incredibly preposterous as to defy all explanation. There are atrocities happening all over the world. The U.S. does not have the resources to police every other country. What about Africa, where people are being slaugtered in incredible numbers? What about the U.S....flailing away with their military attacking countries that have never attacked us causing untold thousands of deaths. And we're setting ourselves up as some kind of good guys? The hypocrisy is overwhelming.
Who do you think did 9/11??? It sure wasn't Israel!!!
I shall find it successful if any American and European traveler or tourist through out Afghanistan doesn't face trouble in the days to come. Modern army and police equipped with rapid deployment capabilities can be helpful in this regard. Eastern borders must be secured. Taliban, Alqaeda and narcotics Mafia must be wiped out before US army quits. A sizable armed presence is vitoal to monitor further development of Afghanistan in right direction.
Why do you think we are helping Pakistan get rid of them too!!!
Right now US troops do nothing to stop the money flow. How stupid. Burn the poppy and cannibas fields to the ground. Mine the lands with IUD's. Execute all drug trafficing persons on the spot. No drug tolerance! These people sell death and use the profits to fiancing guerrila fighters. Follow the money. Cut off the money. Kill the financial heart of the beast.
You should listen to something besides Fox News... Because they are losing their shipments to this Country!!!
Islam is a radical political philosophy, not a religion. Destruction and outlawing of its proponents is as necessary as the disassembly of Nazism and Fascism. And should be fought by all citizens of the world toward that end. If death is what these evil people wish, give it to them in abundance. Curses on all followers of this fantasy called allah and its author mohammad. There is no room on planet Earth for such philosophy.
Not all Muslin think that way... Just as not all Catholics are Criminals because they are the most in Prison!!!
Militarily since the Vietnam war we have been the most technologically powerful nation in the world. But yet we still have not been able to defeat the rice farmer or the sand flea with and AK-47 or a Rocker Propelled Grenade (RPG) who is willing to give up his life for his God or country without question or complaint. Most of all they have no political corruption because there is no established government. Just one mission. To terrorize. We have no way to create sorrow within their ranks for they are martyrs and that is why we will never win.
Bring our people home and take care of our own.
That is not true!!! How do you think Israel wins with all the odds are against them???
Success is not possible when war is the means by which we attempt to achieve change.. The deaths of hundreds of soldiers and civilians and the devastation of a country will never be defined as successful. We would be successful if we focused on building schools and educating the people of Afghanistan.
It is if you train them to take care of themselves!!!
That is what we are trying to do... Hopefully by 2011!!!
Success is defined when our soldiers leave Afghanistan and they no longer in harms way
We would have won Vietnam if We did what Obama is doing an letting the General in charge do his job!!! We buckle down to the United Nation and took our troops out before it was over...
Remember Vietnam 10,000 bodies a month...A month. why we are crying over such a low body count i do not know. these were boys then. In Afghanistan we need to overwhelm them.! simple man power and the technology that we have . use it. maxim fire power at all times . to sit back and not let our men do our job is one thing , but to tell what we do is just dumb. look at the ground in which we fight!. Our enemy had the ground the terrain and surprise. we need to take that away and remember this. "My enemies of my enemy is my friend"
Train Afghan Forces like Mujahideen< like sha of iran,and then later they turn on you and get your ass kicked .
stupid American policy maker.i hope you publish my comment this time,cuz i know you dont publish reality.
The War has only had a plan and strategy for about a year. The previous 8 years were pointless. Many people think that stating July 2011 as a beginning of exit, will result in the Taliban waiting til that happens to assert themselves. If you read the news, that is obviously not true.
Not if we train the Afghanistan Army and Police right they won't!!!
Let's just hope you're right,Bob.We need to lose in order to get out of there.Otherwise.MIC will keep us there forever and a day!
Success will come when the US government realizes that "nation building" takes decades... if it is possible at all in a place like Afghanistan. The current US goal is to set up a US protectorate ..i.e a country with some US troop presence and a government favorable to US interests. The Afghan forces trained by the US are expected to do the heavy lifting while the US forces provide backup. This situation is at least 10 years away and will probably always be 10 years away.
The July 2011 date will be met in the same sense that Nixon started withdrawing troops from Vietnam right after he was installed as president. ... the catch was that the units that were withdrawn were replaced with other units.
Yes train both Iraq and Afghanistan to take care of themselves!!!
This country has to get back to common sense. Barack Obama's Afghanistan war is unnecessary and stupid. Fighting
terrorism and al qaeda should be a law enforcement, commando, CIA, special forces operation not a stupid, costly, deadly ground war. The then Soviets got their asses whipped in Afghanistan and they had way more troops in there than we do now, President Obama's 2008 presidential campaign was based on President Bush's blunder of invading Iraq when they had nothing to do with 9/11. So he is doing the same thing only in Afghanistan. Terrorists can be flushed out of a country preventing it from being a safe haven for them. So what do they do when the U.S. leaves? They come back leaving us no choice but to occupy the country for decades. This is sensless and dumb. We have to go after THEM, no matter where they are, not the country they happen to be in at the time. Our policy in Afghanistan is another ridiculous nation building scheme the administration cooked up. With a corrupt government over there and heroin being their cash crop this venture is doomed to fail.
bringing the taliban to a coalition and helping restructure this country would be an all around winning for the US.
What is Success?? LEAVE AFGHANISTAN WITHOUT GETTING ANOTHER SOLDIER WASTED!
Ultimate objective (be it Republican, Democrat, Independent, other) is to get the heck out of there, than why waste another life. Afghanistan will always be Afghanistan (and I am an optimist).
For those in Washington who are interested in Afghanistan’s Natural Resources Pie, Support most ruthless warlord and get in bed with him, or else we’ll continue counting the coffins for years to come.
I don't think anything can be decided in the next twelve months. You have to get rid of a generation of terrorists. Also where do the Taliban get their supplies from? Food, arms and munitions. Cut off their supply line it will go a long way to winning the war.
Winning in Afghanistan includes killing Osama bin Laden and Ayman al Zawahiri. Next, destroy the grip of al Qaeda and the Taliban on the people who live in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Then, stop the Opium trade by paying the Opium poppy farmers to plant other legitimate cash crops.
Success would be that the troops will be brought home. This war is as crazy to me as Iraq. After having worked with service members with PTSD, I find it disheartening and tragic.
Do away with the insane Rules of Engagement that our troops have to fight under. As is, it's like they have to use a sling-shot. Loosen the RoE and let our troops do what they do best, which is hunt, find and kill the enemy with whatever weapons are necessary and appropriate to the conflict at the time. This is insane to expect victory when you fight with both of your hinds tied behind your back. Did we not learn our lesson in Vietnam. When Nixon loosened the RoE and started bombing the NVA again, they were ready to capitiulize, but Congress and the left stopped the bombing and the war dragged on for 5 more years costing thousands of more lives. It's war, it damn sure ain't a game of tiddly-winks!
I think we should just pull out all together from this stupid war. I mean really. Why is the US always the big brother? No one else is helping like we do and it's putting our country in debt. I don't see any other countries jumping in to help us for anything yet any time there's an earthquake, hurrican, civil unrest in another country we spend all of OUR money and help them. Why should we sacrifice our Brothers, Sisters, Fathers, Mothers, Wives and Husbands? So I agree with oromuse. We need to butt out and get out.
We've already succeeded. We kicked the al Qaida out and gave the Taliban a good lesson they'll not forget. Now get out. You are just wasting lives and aren't doing any good. Let them govern themswelves. If they do it again, go in and kick them again. Eventually they'll get the message to mind their own business while respecting the rights of the world around them. It's not up to us to tell them how to behave in their own country.
Live in Pakistan,
move to Norway,
PROFIT!!! (if you get rejected by the authorities you get a fine sum
of a lot of money if you return from whence you came)
sorry, patience, not passion.. forgive my bad English
NATO should be prepared for longer involvement. Afghanistan in mid 2011 wouldn't still be Iraq now, because Afghanistan war is a war that at one side didn't take as many casualties per year as Iraq, but it needed more passion. The intensity of battles and resistance/insurgency in Afghanistan is relatively low (compare it with Iraq, Vietnam, WW II), but it needs longer time because NATO couldn't come there just as liberator, it must be a nation-builder. Afghanistan isn't a nation, it's a bunch of tribes. I think NATO should give another 4-5 years, and I think it's extremely worth it.
Success in Afghanistan is the birth of hope in their people, progress in law enforcement, economic growth, and faith in democracy. Talibans would still be around, but it's becoming more and more insignificant. First it'll lose its centralized power (which has happened now), second, with decentralization it'll lose its uniformity and comformity (also is happening now), third, it'll lose its ideological militancy at all and turn into groups of money-oriented bandits (at this point it no longer poses threat internationally), four, it'll adapt to peace.
Success will be an Afghan solution to the problem. My headquarters is training the Afghan Army and Police to take the lead in the war. The Afghans have to decide to throw out the terrorist and end the war. You can read more about our training efforts at ( http://www.NTM-A.com )
i WATCHED IT AND THANKS FOR JOINING COMMENT PAGE
THE PEASFULLY WITHDRwn of forces is sucess. otherwise cowered withdraw will be shame
Success in Afghanistan?
A treaty is made with the Taliban which guarantee's civil rights to Islamic women in Afghanistan.
Hamid Karzai is exiled not on the American taxpayer dollars in whatever country will take him and his clan.
The Taliban remove and forbid Opium Poppys from being grown and cultivated in the entire country
The US Military returns with 99% of their heavy equipment and vehicles so that unlike in Vietnam, the American taxpayers aren't entirely stuck with replacing dumped and abandoned gear with hyper-expensive upgrades.
The US Congress begins closing hundreds of oversea's cold war era bases around the world.
The US Congress begins dwindling the funding to Pakistan and The Pentagon's Shadow projects.
Commercial Ethanol from sugar cane plantations in America cease America's need for Saudi Oil and declare a end to 'Oil Wars' as it no longer needs any Oil from the Middle East.
We should pull out, but we will most definitaly be attacked by the taliban. When this does happen we retaliate with whatever force was used on us.
Most of Those who are commenting over here, have absolutely no idea whats going on there on grounds ...
thats how western media teaches us and you about the situations out side ur countries ... they show what ever they want to and they hide what ever they want.
Western Powers made a very bad image out of Taliban people by making fake stories, fake movies and exaggerating facts with out considering ground realities of culture and society ... but now they are in a situation where they have to make a deal with those so called bad people but they are unable to figure out how to satisfy their people on this thing ... so .. lets discuss over here and lets discuss on TV shows to calm down public sentiments and make grounds for the next move ...
Right the Taliban aren't the tarriest Israel is right?>??
Maybe we wouldn't have so many problems in the middle east if we would stop supporting a racist and hateful religion and letting them murder a race of people in order to steal everything they own!!
you must not speak truth in this world of "wisdom" and "knowledge" ....
but i must say that no religion is hateful and no religion teaches hate .. it is all politics .. some times in the name of economical systems and some times in the name of religion ...
Good observation Ali.
I might agree with you if I knew which side your talking about!!! Because the Majority of the People on here are against Israel... Israel is not the problem over there... They would make PEACE today if the Muslin would agree!!!
Success in Afghanistan should be defined as 0$ spent in Afghanistan from Tax payers money.
Success in USA should be defined as a ban on giving even a single $ from lobbyist and big corporations to politicians who would obviously do their bidding later own.
How many lobbyists do you see over there? Just curious.
That is where you are wrong... Success is when they are trained to take care of themselves in every way!!!
How I would define success:
No central theocracy
Loose confederation of tribal or regional governing bodies
Destruction of the opium poppies in conjunction with the re-establishment of self supporting agricultural
A clear understanding by the Afghan leadership (warlords, tribal leaders, and corrupt government officials) that if they let any terrorist organization use Afghanistan as a base that we will bomb the s*** out of them and stop supporting their corrupt lifestyle.
All we can do is train them to do the right thing and keep the tarriest out of their country!!! We can't force them from not doing different... What they do after them is their choice!!!
Since I was 6 years Old and I rembered my father asked when peace comes to homeland and war ends. Now 30 years passed and my father died, and I am asking the same question with hopes when peaces comes to our country and war ends. One day my child will ask the same question. Since then I remebered some of countries like British, Russian and now USA comes to afghanistan asking the same question how they can be successful in afghanistan.
I hope you get what you want Omar. Peace would be great success. In your lifetime.
Our hopes and wishes not completed yet until peace comes to our country and our people live in freedom. Thanks Sandra!
I think most People of the world would love to see PEACE in their life time... But as long as you have creddy people that can make money off the wars!!! There will never be PEACE...
IT IS TRUE LARRY
I say its time to send in the special units... POWER RAGERS!!!!
When every last taliban has been eliminated.
No when they have no place to go to train their tarriest!!!
A friendly stable government willing to fight terrorism and opium production.
Success Should be defined in two parts. First, Was the initial shock and awe invasion able to put you in charge of the country to do whatever operations you would like? Second, After leaving your occupation of the country; Did the country grow economically,medically (birth rate, life expectancy) and do they have a favorable view of your country in measurable terms, such as good trade, cultural favoratism (rock and roll, etc...) relative peace and security administered by themselves.
My biggest thing is that success cannot be measured until you leave an ocupation. otherwise you are mothering the nation and they will never have to be responsible for themselves.
It did in Korea and Vietnam!!! Hopefully it will also in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan too...
Definition of Success: When we can save men from themselves.
Afghans are a conquerable people. Period. Most are illiterate, and aren't serious about security in their country. You can build a million schools and bridges, and that is all well and good, but when you have 26% desertion rate for the ANA, you cannot defend a country and its citizens. Most of the Afghan Taliban have fled to Pakistan and they will return when we pull out and will reestablish their grip. The Afghan soldiers willl simply lay down their weapons. I wish DOD would own up to that. I know they are not that stupid. Unfortunately senior leaders, defense contractors only get paid and get accolades while they are waging war. To continue to say we are making progress is ludicrous.
Pakistan and the USA are fighting them there to,,, To try to get them out of both Countries!!! If we can get PEACE between Pakistan and India... Then the Tarriest will have know place to go!!!
I'm just back from 5 weeks in A'stan with the Marines; Marjah and Nimroz:
1 – Success will be if GIROA stands up and does their job. Outside of Marjah, they are. The ANA does a great job, and is the most respected part of the Afghan government. The Dept of Education is sending lots of teachers into the villages.
2 – The 'deadline' was always subject to 'conditions permitting', and Petraeus is already backing away from it. But it's still necessary so that Karzai knows he needs to step up and take ownership of his country.
3 – The Marines are doing a great job on the south. They patrol, they live with the locals, and the locals respond accordingly. The Army needs to get off their FOB's and realize they're in a combat zone. You can't practice COIN by sitting in an MRAP or Buffalo and pretending you're on patrol.
4 – Petraeus needs to get the Army out of Bagram and Kandahar and into the field. 25,000 at BAF; 18,000 at KAF. Doing what???
5 – We have some incredible young men and women fighting; it'd be nice if the American public paid attention to them. Thank you CNN!!
Very will put!!!
Unfortunately, there can be no "success" in Afghanistan or the Middle East.
One would have to alter the culture drastically (something that no occupying empire/army in the history of the World can boast to doing). Religion rules with extremist views. People who do not value each other equally, cannot obtain any sort of peace.
All of these factors contribute to the majority of the population unwilling to change (whether it by fear and oppression or just not knowing any different). Not to mention that in their eyes, we are an invading force, regardless of what we say we are.
The governments run like the mafia, so much of the aid and resources sent end up back in the hands of the "enemy" anyway.
I've been deployed twice to Iraq as an Infantryman and as an intel gatherer. I've seen the beginning and I'm witnessing the end. I wish I could say my buddies fought and died for a good cause; but what it comes down to is that they fought because of their committment to America and not for these people. We have been betrayed and spat on at every turn.
There is no winning. The best we can do has already been done. They have been prepared and now it's time to come home. Home to our loved ones and to focus on the problems on our own home front.
My wife would love to see me home in one piece so can we end this already?
I'm writing letters like crazy to get you home.
That is exactly what the United States is trying to do with Iraq and Afghanistan now... By training them to take care of themselves!!!
The US has gone into war in Afghanistan illegally. There is no reason why the US should invade and occupy another sovereign nation.The US is not the world police and are more concern on how to change the culture of other nations to be hedonistic as what the US is now.The US has created chaos, destruction,death and instabilityin the region and has acheived nothing thus far. The US just wants to bully weak nations and waste lives and money.
Whatever bad publicity that had been portrayed about Afghanistan was just propaganda. There are many more serious crimes and injustice in the US than in Afghanistan before the invasion,so how can the US try to manage others when it can't even mange itself?
The US will fail just like in Vietnam and Iraq. Success is defined by total US withdrawal and let the Afghans manage themselves.
i'm guessing you all are white people or at least americans. Because they don't think before they do something.
Crikey, the elusive white American... the most dangerous and unpredictable creature on the planet! Coming next week, a creature just as volitile: The pregnant hispanic woman!
Afghanistan is a common third world nation. All the Super Powers together with all their Super Weapons have not been able to defeat a bunch of low tech illiterates after ten years and we are talking about success? Something is wrong. I believe that we miscalculated. America relied too much on fire power alone. It is obvious that all our Super/Smart Weapons have failed us. We need to look for other ways to end the war. Ten years and trillions of dollars used fighting a third world country? That is scary to me.
What do you think were doing!!!
It bothers me whenever I hear the government talk about success in Iraq and Afghanistan. The whole talk is an absolute nonsense to me. We invaded Iraq looking for Weapons of Mass Destruction. None was found. We invaded Afghanistan looking for Osama Bin Laden, the guy was long gone before we even got there. So why all these talk about success? No WMD found, Osama escaped us. We have already failed on both missions. Unless the government lied to us their real intent for the two invasions. Our boys should pack up and return home. I know it is not that easy, but it is the right thing to do.
Think of it a little different. What if a lobby or special interest group that has an interest in a different country were to get into our government and direct defense funds to protect it's interests? Perhaps the goal would be something like trying to make the middle east safe for that country to exist? Then does it make sense?
Some people think lobby and special interest groups that are acting in the best interest of a different country should be registered as foreign agents, and subject to more accountability to the American public. But, that is fought hard. Lots of info on that on the web.
Sandra The U.S would be a safe happy country and so would the world, if you would be President.
Go for it, the noise behind you are your followers.
Maybe what you would consider a success is different than the way the Government looks at it!!!
Sandra: We have to stop them all together because this Country goes completely broke!!!
Sorry, I lost that. Who is "them"?
Success in Afghanistan should be defined as the creation of government trusted by the people with appropriate representation. Afghanistan is not the United States, we can't expect the same freedoms to be enforced there. However, a sovereign, autonomous Afghan government that the people can at least be rely on for protection and basic necessities would give a level confidence and stability.
A previous problem was economy based on opium, with the recent discovery of massive mineral deposits, that should change things in the long run. With an economic prospect such as that, it will encourage all groups towards a more stable environment to take advantage of this, even if it might leave some with the short end of the stick.
So the means to success is relatively simple if you ignore nuances that the public either doesn't know or fully appreciate: the Afghan government must be rid of corruption. We should look to what we did and did not do in Iraq and see what conditions existed that allowed the creation of that government.
Your usual not understandable babble, that only you, yourself, might be able to understand, when you're heavily drugged
Stop dreaming & come out of the fools paradise their is no success any where in sight roll up your bags & go home as the only thrice defeated super power in the world 1) Vietnam 2) Iraq 3) Afghanistan Bye Bye, Sayonara ,Adious
It's not a world worth living in anymore. War torn planet. Polluted by man made disasters. No hope left for this. It's engrained so deep in the male psyche that it's not possible to save them until its too late. That's a problem.
The only hope I see is to help them see it.
This is a start, but her books will hit it harder than anyone can explain here.
Armageddon should take care of all the remaining problems
Sandra,the main problem here is this incessant hatred and right-wing mob mentality.
Right, but where does that come from? I'm looking for the root cause. This is as close as I can get: mitworld.mit.edu/video/729 , but her books get so much more in depth. Is it a training issue? Are we training our kids wrong? That's what I want to know. Can we have an impact on the world if we train our kids different? (It's complicated, I know. But, look at the problems that we have in the world today...and how many involve males. I happen to like men and I don't think they live long enough. How do we save them from themselves? And I wonder if the root is the way we train them...or more specifically...is it time for the patriarchy to take a serious hike? I'm leaning toward yes.)
You can't say anything against these Races... But they don't care about what they say with Their lies!!!
I believe success in Afghanistan is when the citizens of the nation is not threatened on a daily basis, arguments are settled by debate, not by bombs or attacks, and everyone can get a small slice of peace and calm. That can be called success.
Now that would be fair!!!
Wht don't you join the Taliban since you like them so much.
Sorry,Bubba,I'm only trying to be fair minded.
You are anything but fair minded. To be so would entail some sort of balanced view something you sadly lack.
How is it being fair minded by thinking the wrong way??? Being fair is what is best for all the People involved!!!
This war is no doubt taking way to long! My son is currently serving in Afghanistan, at the base that was just attacked in Jalalabad. We need to be realistic, I don't see how it is possible to bring our soldiers home by next year. Our own strategies are failing it seems at the cost of our soldiers lives/injuries, not to mention that the cost of this war is astronomical. I wish our top guys could find a way soon, because I would like nothing more for my son to be home with his new bride and his family!
Write letters. You have power as a parent.
I tried that and the Republicans still do what they want to do!!!
If Bush would have done it this way... It would have been over a long time ago!!! But he had to take the troops out... Then start the Iraq war instead!!!
Debbie, you too are in my prayers!!
I guess I have said this here before. The Taliban, many of the young Pashtun and Afghan fighters have no wives, no families, no sweethearts and no homes of their own. The one thing they do have is the respect of other radical Muslims, even those in Western countries. They will never be driven out of the mountains in Afghanistan and the Northwest Frontier Provinces short of a war with India.
That is what you think!!! Doesn't make it true...
Partial success will be when we stop supporting the patriarchy. When society stops lying to men and teaching boys that war is heroic, and that men are over women, children...and other men. When the patriarchy dies and people see each other through a more democratic lens where all voices are heard and are considered with equal weight. Seems like that would wipe out a significant portion of our problems. Too much to write here, but this is a good start: mitworld.mit.edu/video/729. I would highly recommend reading the full versions of In A Different Voice, The Birth of Pleasure, The Deepening Darkness.
I think that would go a long way to dealing with a lot of the conflict that we see today. I think there will always be cases that fall outside of normal...and those might have more to do with sociopaths. I'm not sure there's much you can do about that, but be aware that they exist. They don't have a conscience, but they know you do so they can use that to get into positions of power. (Read The Sociopath Next Door.)
People have to learn to treat each other better. The world doesn't work very well when you leave out human emotion. People don't forget. It doesn't work that way. The sooner we stop denying that truth...the sooner we will get to something that closer resembles success.
Just about every conflict that you read about is proof that ignoring human emotions doesn't work.
You do realize that the Jihad is for women, right? if it were easier to find virgins in the real world, you wouldn't have to blow yourself up to get 77 of them.
I'd rather be content then, with a few non-virgins, and staying alive to enjoy them.
Feminist isn't the right word. Watch the video...you will get it. (All genders lose in a patriarchy.)
I'm not convinced that having a dedicated industrial military complex was in our best interest. It probably got us into things that we shouldn't be involved in...and hard to get out of.
People don't forget...and even if one person dies...others don't forget. So...best to avoid the trauma all the way around if you can. War is too extreme. I think it's outdated.
That is easier said than done!!!
Well. Seems like everyone here has an opinion, even if some comments are not very informed. For those of you who think we should "cut our losses" and leave, will you personally raise your hand and be held accountable for the next 9/11 type incident that originates from the Afghan/Pakistan border?
There is a strategy in this conflict. It has been communicated in one form or another on several occasions. We are there to help increase the competency and authority of the government of Afghanistan to the point where it can see to its own security, internal and external affairs, and deny safe-haven to extremist groups. Our strategy is flexible, and it is frustrating at times. It will take a great deal of time, effort, resources and sacrifice. For those of you inclined to read more than three sentences at a time, read Army FM 3-24–it is quite informative.
This conflict will take a long time to resolve. Many people do not like this, but simply because one does not "like" a strategy does not mean that one does not exist.
Afghanistan has been in turmoil since 1978, was practically destroyed by over a decade of civil-war, and has had almost zero education for an entire generation. American counter-insurgency efforts did not begin in earnest in Afghanistan until 2009 (troop-surge anyone?). The idea that Afghanistan can rise-up from 30 years of strife and be "good-to-go" in two years is unrealistic at best.
As far as "true democracy" and "corruption" goes, please Google "Representative Republic" and "Illinois Governor". I'll gladly settle for a stable, functioning government in Afghanistan, and I'll hardly expect it to be perfect.
We owe it to the soldiers (my friends and colleagues) who have already died in this conflict, our own people, and the Afghans we abandoned after the Soviets withdrew to see this through. Yeah, it's going to suck–doing the right thing often does.
You're just speaking my mind. Thanks for finally a well informed and intelligent input
Finally, an informed voice from a man who has been there. Philosophically, I'm opposed to war, period. But the United States is, at last, pursuing a policy in Afghanistan that makes sense. I do not believe that "conditions on the ground" will warrant a pull-out in 2011. I hope they do but I don't believe they will. But we are far better off leaving a nation that functions than we would be leaving it in chaos.
Most people just want to be safe and raise their families. We should help them do that. We should not try to convert them to an American Way of Life. We should simply help them be free to live their lives as they see fit. In peace. Our policy to clear an area and help stabilize it is the best way of doing that. Left Afghanistan in chaos before. Look where it got us.
People who get what they need from their government in the way of security won't be enticed to strap on explosives and bomb their fellow citizens.
The best thing we can be doing in America is supporting our troops who are in Afghanistan because they have a job to do there.
We did not ask to be attacked but we were so now we have to pursue our attackers. In the process, we should not make it easy for those who hate us to get back into power anywhere.
I do not believe we can kill our our enemies, nor should we try. But we can help make sure there are very few places in the world where those enemies can gain a foothold.
The only thing NATO is "freeing" in Afghanistan is it's resources for the MIC(military-industrial-compex) so the West can exploit them to their heart's content!
You don't say???
THANKS FOR GIVING YOUR TIME TO WRITE ABOUT SOMETHING WE DONT SEE THERE. HOPE WE ALL WILL ABLE TO HAVE FREEDOM FOR THE HIGH PRICE ALL THE MEN WHO DIED THERE HAVE PAID. MANY HAVE BEEN TOO YOUNG TO SACRIFICE THEIR LIFE FOR OTHERS BENEFIT. I WANT TO WRITE ABOUT AFGHAN PEOPLE AND PAKISTAN PEOPLE TOO AS I AM SURE SOME OF THEM ALSO HAVE HELPED TO MINIMIZE TERRORISTS FROM SENDING STUFF TO PEOPLE AGAINST TERRORISM. I WANT TO SEE A HAPPY AFGHANISTAN BEFORE I PASS THIS PLANET. MAY GOD HELP PEOPLE WHO HELP OTHERS TO LIVE IN FREEDOM.
Food for thought: An historical fact for those who thing winning battles always wins wars. It is a fact that American forces won almost every sustained battle fought during the Vietnam War, yet we lost the War. Casualty estimates range from 4 to 6 million North and South Vietnam soldiers and civilians. Obviously, killing and wounding people did not lead to victory. Our military efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan will never succeed unless we meet their peoples' needs as well.
A pointer here might be, that actually politics lost the Vietnam War, not the soldiers on the ground, who clearly would have won the whole war, if it hadn't been for the crazy strategies being imposed by civilians, like the "flexible response" stragegy, that killed so many of our men, for nothing, and we just have to be careful in Afghanistan, that politicians are not to tell us to do the same, seize areas, clean them and leave again, so they were immediately overrun by the enemy again, all waisted, because we didn't stick to the areas, we had taken. The strategy McChrystal imposed, was exactly the importance og keeping seized areas, not pulling back, but waiting to go on, until the area was fortified with enough Afghan soldiers and political leaders, to keep the area themselves. A very wise strategy. But of course it takes time to do that properly, so no fixed withdrawal time should be stated, and it would save a lot of lives, not to have to go in and come back later again, having gained nothing
What do you think Obama is trying to do!!! It sure didn't work the way Bush did it...
I'm just curious......does the United States even have a strategy on what to do in Afghanistan? It seems like every other war we get ourselves into.....we go in fast and hard and then realize we don't have a plan in place on what to do next.
This war will reach 10 years next year. And like all the battles the US has picked that have lasted this long. There is no winning. When the prevailing philosphy is still opposed to our ideals then the effort for true democracy in Afghanistan is highly unlikely to succeed. The Afghani people must decide on how they want & when they want to improve their lives. We have bled enough to make our point but its time to cut our losses and take our sons and daughters home.
This is one highly smart comment you stated, i will give you props and respect what you have to say.
Why do you think thery want the troops out by next year!!!
Why do you think they want the troops out by next year!!!
Politically its a tough one. All I can say to the troops is to keep kicking ass and keep yourself from getting hurt. We know that on the battlefield you winning. Look at the recent news : 150 Taliban killed yesterday, 8 more killed in their attack on the airfield today. i know kill ratios dont mean victory (aka Vietnam) but all the soldiers can do is their job, and they are doing it well.
Make sure to look at the list view as well.
I'm sorry, but nobody is winning here. (You have been lied to.)
That is so very true!!!
THE UNITED STATES NEED TO LET US MULIMS LIVE OUR LIFE ACCOURDING TO HOW WE WANT TO LIVE IT AND WORRY ABOUT THEIR ON COUNTRY INSTEAD. I DON'T KNOW HOW STUPED THE U.S GOV IS FIGHTING WITH THE TALIBAN, THEY DIDNT LIEARN FROM WHAT HAPPEND TO THE SOVIET UNION. THE MORE TROOPS THE US SENDS THE STRONGER THE TALIBA GET. AND THIS WAR WILL NEVER END INTELL THE US WITHDRAWS IT TROOPS FROM AFGHANISTAN AND REST OF ISLAMIC COUNTRIES.
Maybe we should have taken that "hands off" policy when Muslims were being slaughtered wholesale in Bosnia.
I love how when we fight Extremists and Terrorists, someone goes and says that we are "fighting Muslims". This sort of talk is what makes people believe that Muslims are evil. Hey, we're trying to not lump mulsims into the same category. But a pile of terrorist corpses is an "atrocity against Islam" these days, so they must all be terrorists or violent militants.
He was probably referring to the over 100,000 INNOCENT Muslims who have died during this war.
They kill their own in mast... So why should they care about that!!! The don't appreciate other peoples help... They think they are trying to take them over!!!
We would if you would be killing Americans!!! That is one thing we don't like...
You fool! Once Al Quaida flew planes into buildings and it was as though you kicked a hornets nest!, Look what happened, a war in Iraq and a regime change. 10's of thousands of dead Iraqi's and Afgans. An invasion of Afghanistan and the diminishment of the Taliban. Those opposing the US are ignorant animals and have no chance. We can send drones after you, we have spy satellites, technology beyond you're imagination, and you think this is the British or Russian armies. You have as much chance of stopping America as you do from stopping the Earth from turning. Osama Bin Laden if still alive, is living like an Animal. follow him and die, or recognize that God is not on your side!
Please tell us how many American are People from other Countries have to die before you say enough is enough???
WE WOULD IF YOU LEAVE OTHER COUNTRIES ALONE!!!
Well, come on all of you, big strong men,
Uncle Sam needs your help again.
He's got himself in a terrible jam
Way down yonder in Afghanistan
So put down your books and pick up a gun,
We're gonna have a whole lotta fun.
And it's one, two, three,
What are we fighting for ?
Don't ask me, I don't give a damn,
Next stop is Vietnam;
And it's five, six, seven,
Open up the pearly gates,
Well there ain't no time to wonder why,
Whoopee! we're all gonna die.
And my vote for lamest poem goes to.......
I will second that!
I'm 72 years old!!! I doubt if they want me...
A lot needs to happen and a lot needs to change in order for "success" (whatever that may be) to be achieved in Afghanistan.
For starters (and probably most importantly), the Afghan government needs to "un-corrupt" themselves... and fast! The very fact that we have troops dying over there for a country and a government that couldn't care less what happens to American/NATO soldiers is sickening. I'd be stern with Karzai, and tell him that we'll pull out every last solider by the end of the year, with the last soldiers shooting and bombing the government buildings if he doesn't clean his act up soon. And I'm serious, too. It's ridiculous how corrupt and dysfunctional the Karzai clan is. I'm tired of reading stories about dozens of NATO troops dying every week, only to read the next story about how Karzai bashed America for "civilian casualties" and how his brother is a corrupt nut-case involved in the drug trade in Kandahar. Clean up your act, or we'll leave Afghanistan and really "clean up" with bombs on the way out.
Secondly... NATO troops need to be given the proper resources to actually get the job done. I'm not just saying more troops, aircraft, ect... I mean actually BEING ABLE to kill the enemy, and not be strapped by rules of engagement that are only getting our soldiers killed. If the Taliban shoots out of a building, there should be a bomb bursting through the roof of it within seconds. We should have drone aircraft in the sky 24/7 around all the hot spots like Sangin, Marjah, Kandahar, ect. The EXACT SECOND a soldiers calls for help, there should be no question about anything. So help me God if I have to hear another story from people I know over there about how their request for air support was denied.
We're not winning in Afghanistan because we are fighting on the Taliban's terms. Normal Afghans wonder why the world's greatest super power can't defeat the Taliban. It's because we fight blindfolded with one hand behind our backs. Enough is enough. If someone is digging in the road or in some alleyway at night, there should be no question that they should be bombed to oblivion. Show the Taliban that planting IED's is only going to get you killed. This is war, and perception is key. The Afghans see the Taliban being successful lately, and they also fear the Taliban... that's a double whammy of "well, I'm not going to help NATO." Saying hello and giving out candy is not working.
Fight the war the way it needs to be fought (not on the Taliban's terms). Make the Karzai clan into something that's actually FOR the people of Afghanistan. We won't win unless these two things are accomplished.
You are right. Except with regards to Karzai. Whatever people might say about cheating at the elections, he's the only legally elected president of Afghanistan, elected by the Afghans themselves, and more so, he's a Pashtun, his clan populating the most dangerous areas of the south, so we're not the one's to come and say, that we should do this or that to Karzai. Right now we're trying to help the Afghans, to control the issues, such as drugrelated crimes, and the corruption stemming from this, with an enormous white wash operation of drug money, with our Attorney General, and his Afghan counterpart, adressing these problems, carrying out big operations, as we speak here. So alongside with fighting the war, all other issues are also being addressed, such as local development, infrastructure, schooling etc., and a first class medical treatment, for all, friend or foe, in our top class field hospitals. A lot of good things are going on there, not reaching the puclics awareness, as the positive news, are bad news for the media
We are winning even though Nato and other Countries aren't doing Their fair share of fighting!!! But for sure we will win there as long as we do what Our Generals say we must do...
I do NOT believe that, currently, we are going to be successful. But – beyond the comments left by others here (some accurate and some less than) we also need to pay very close attention to so many aspects of things as they are.
We must provide our soldiery a realistic opportunity to squash the Taleban – NOT engage in ridiculous positioning of troops into untenable situations – NOT announce our plans ahead of time (mentioned by other post) and NOT be held to ridiculous timelines.
HOWEVER we must also be realistic and honest in our real intent for the country of Afghanistan. If we are not honest in our true intent – NO campaign will ever succeed.
That's true. That's the most important point to have in mind, for all of us down there.
WELL WRITTEN BRIAN HORTON
Karzai and his family must go. The US can't win this war when corrupted Karzai is the president of that country.
yes karzai family should go......but in prison.
Who do you think should take his place???
yes you right man, very intelligent, bright brains
at first karzai – your pappet, then all afgan people
and the empty afganistan will be yours – american
and then all natural recourses will be yours
and then you make afganistan part of america
and then after afganistan some other country
and so later all planet will fall into your american hands
Newsflash! We don't want your crappy country. Thanks for playing.
i believe the only way to win is to get rid of karzai and his family and cronies out of afgan government ,maybe then u s assistance reach the average people
We can't tell them who should be Their leader... We could end up with one worse than we have now!!! If we could Bush Jr would not have been President... Then we wouldn't have the mess we have today!!!
We should get out and let the chips fall where they may. We cannot remake Afghan Moslem society.
Very well stated,Abdulameer.
It is not a matter of changing the Muslim society, but rather destroying terrorism (though people link them together radical terrorism only consists of 1% of Muslim population who are very extreme). This is a difficult task and will never be completely destroyed, however we can make it so they are unable to act against us.
Do you honestly believe all that right-wing mumbo-jumbo about the "extremists" being only 1% of the Muslim population?If that's the case,how do they continue fighting with no outside help,whatsoever?And especially when the other side has all the tanks,artillery,aircraft and billions of dollars?
That is what we did when Bush Sr left Iraq!!! We had to go back there because it didn't do any good... That is why we are doing it Obama's way it will work!!!
Success in Afghanistan. When normal, everyday citizens can find a job and support their families without having to resort to joining the Taliban (militant or drug trade). In my experience, people act with their finances in mind more so than their ideology. When structure and civility comes to Afghanistan, violence will leave. I think this view of "success" depends on the development of a (functioning) government that provides, and a police force that protects (and pays more than the Taliban!)
Terribly difficult, but not impossible. I don't think it will be done by July 2011, but I'm willing to give it a chance.
Success in Afghanistan means that the already rich will become even weathier along with the foreign nationals while the average Afghan will only get poorer and poorer and at the same time possibly lead to a wider war in Asia.Who in their right mind wants that???
There's a CD with former Secretary of State, Madeline Albright, that addresses the fear of war with China. (She thinks it would be highly unlikely. For the most part, the Chinese are like us in that a large portion of the population is the sandwich generation...taking care of our kids and aging parents is enough to keep our hands full. Not interested in war.) I think it was in Memos to the President Elect.
I think we are walking on thin ice all over the planet though. People don't forget. So even if tyrants think they win for the moment...people don't forget much. We really do have to get to a point where we are treating each other better. The world is MUCH more connected than it used to be.
Jared, I think it's a great idea, but that sort of thing takes years and years to accomplish. The money and support needs to come from somewhere. It can't come from our military, it comes when the people decide they want it (revolutions are helpful). And you can't fight terrorism with an army. The "war on terror" cannot be won, terrorism will always exist, sadly, but in varying magnitudes.
It would help if we could get people past the idea that they have to conquer the world. We need to get them to grow up. They think they are being good because they are winning at what the world taught them was right...but, society lied to them. It's not all about winning. Sometimes it's just about being respectful to each other.
It is happening in the United States!!! How do you expect the rest of the World do different???
Sandra: We are not trying to take over the world... But we sure don't need a 3rd world country trying to take over ours!!!
The politicians need to stop tying the hands of the military, in the effort to get the job done.
You cannot fight a guerrilla war, where civilians and combatants look the same, and listen to Karzai, complain about civilian deaths. Those "civilians", are associating with the Taliban, pure and simple.
The military has to be freed to take strong and decisive action, and to totally eliminate the Taliban from existence. To do less, will ensure failure.
We learned that from Vietnam... It is the Muslin and other crazy that don't realize that!!! Those that we in the Service are the only ones that know the truth about that!!!
that's what i was thinking all the time. Thank you.
why on earth you should announce before attacking a place ? it's just stupid !
First complete your mission then announce the damn thing.
Announcing like: Taliban, we are coming to Kandahar, hide and run somewhere then come back later and attack us back ! W T F !!!!!
What freightens me is that this success might lead to yet a wider war in Asia and I don't want that.
I don't think so, most of the citizens want us out of Afganistan when the combat mission is done (some want us out prematurely). Any bigger war in central asia would greatly angered many people and I believed that no one in the county and in Washington or allied government and countries. would not love that. Bigger war in Central Asia by NATO? Very, very unlikely.
Val,what's to stop NATO from starting one if it wants to?Besides,the NATO forces are no more heroic than the Russians before them although the right-wing news media trys to brainwash us into thinking otherwise.Think for yourself!!!
It is the Republicans that start the wars and the Democrats has to get us out!!!
The powers to be are pushing for a WW3
This war with Pakistan and Afghanistan is stopping WWIII not starting it!!!
I really doubt that will happen!!!
It's only politics, to give that one year deadline. Everyone in the field knows that, especially, now "late", Gen. McCrystal, as that was his contention point to Pres. Obama, that it was impossible to keep this deadline, as it will take us much longer to train the amount of Afghans needed, to keep government rule in the areas we have cleaned of Taliban, and also to get rid of all the drug-related corruption, that the american Attorney General, together with his Afghan counterpart, are working so hard to eradicate. Only politicians, at a safe distance, thousands of miles away, promise this deadline, to appease their electorate. We have to be realistic, not setting dates, but setting goals instead, and not also setting fixed dates, as the Taliban then, will just lie low, hiding, as usual, behind their women skirts, killing only child "informers", who can't defend themselves, until our target date is reached, and we go home, and they get out of hiding, taking over again, inviting the Al Queda back to safety from Pakistan, helped along by the ISI, and then we'd be back at square one, and all our boys, of the coalition forces, will have died in vain, just because power-hungry politicians' decisions. Shame on you !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If we see they aren't trying enough we will pull the troops out!!! If they are learning right we still will be able to pull the troops out... We can not afford to have Our troops there for ever!!! Not at what these wars are costing us...
If we succeed in Afghanistan,it might just open up Central Asia to NATO for the taking.
Thanks,Gary.That's what scares me.
Is that Funny boy again?
No this is me!
Maybe you're right, i suppose. But who in their right mind would want it? Can you think of one reason or one thing that would happen except to antagonise the Chinamen?
Doesn't the United States,Great Britain and France want their almost limitless oil reserves which are located in Central Asia?Of course they do and the more they succeed in Afghanistan,the likelier they'll get them.
Nato has enough just to take care of Europe alone Asia too!!!
I don't think we should announce our plans. It gives the enemy a heads up and they can make their plans accordingly.
that's what i was thinking all the time. Thank you.
why on earth you should announce before attacking a place ? it's just stupid !
First complete your mission then announce the damn thing.
Announcing like: Taliban, we are coming to Kandahar, hide and run somewhere then come back later and attack us back ! W T F !!!!!!!
How absurd! You read the news here, then make the assertion that it is stupid to announce your plan to attack an area to that area. The news media does that incessantly! Remember when the search into terrorist activities in Yemen made headlines with the failed NYC car bomb attack? Might as well have Fed Ex'd air fare to the terrorists!
The war in Afghan, up until Obama's first promised troop surge after his election, was a failure because the coalition forces were seen by Afghans as just one more racist group killing Arabs, who would abandon them once they have a belly full of death. The changes in our rules of engagement were designed to redress that factor. Keep in mind, throughout the conflict there have been some special units that have specific objectives that operate under very different rules.
Success is an independent Afghanistan that has the conomic resources to out-spend the drug lords and the terrorists by providing legitimate economic opportunities for their people.
It isn't like we gave them right on the date we will withdraw!!!
That is one way to get the Cowards out of there and have less of Our Troops killed!!!
yeah true still i like the idea of a date in which we can see this crap pile end i just wish it wasn't anoucsed to the world
The justification for a deadline is so the Afghan government knows we won't be around forever. However, we will not meet this deadline because too much has yet to be accomplished. In order to call Aghanistan a success several objectives need to be met. We must create a stable government, Karzi is extremely corrupt, second there has to be a stable economy with jobs that don't involve harvesting poppy plants for the Taliban, because the Taliban uses that to fund their war, third they need a well trained army and police force that can handle Taliban forces without us. Fourth, we need to win the hearts and minds of the people, build schools, hospitals, roads, and creating jobs is part of that. Fifth, we take out all the major players amongst the Taliban and the rest that aren't radicalized get them jobs in the army or else where. Sixth we slowly with draw troops and replace our positions with Afghan soldiers. Taliban eliments may still be around but not as popular and can be islolated and kept under control by Afghan soldiers. This will take more than a year. This will take 2 maybe as long as 5 more years, if can done at all. I believe some objectives can be met but not all. This won't be a clear cut victory, and I don't know how much more the American people can take. So, when we do leave it will leave a bitter taste in our mouth, as if this campaign was not worth the price.
Since they're not Arabs I doubt they view us as Arab killers. Announcing our arrival has working in Iraq and I think that's why they did it but people tend to forget this is not Iraq and the two countries are not alike in anyway. They speak different languages, have different beliefs, education, morals and a different history. It is a folly to compare the two.
So that the Afghanistan will know they have to take care of themselves before we leave!!! We will not be there for ever to take care of then...
Success in Afghanistan is quite simple. When baby girls stop getting acid thrown in their faces as Islamic threats prohibilting women from learning how to read.
Are the Taliban really doing that or is that just more right-wing propaganda?
Yes it is true. This is an article from cnn. You can also go to Google and put in "acid thrown in school girls faces in afghanistan " and you will get story after criminal story. Sad.
KABUL, Afghanistan (CNN) - Two men on a motorcycle used water pistols to spray acid on girls walking to school Wednesday in the southern Afghan city of Kandahar, blinding at least two of them, military spokesmen said.
U.S. Col. Greg Julian said Afghanistan's National Military Command Center told him that four girls were hurt in the incident. Two were blinded and remain hospitalized, and two were treated and released, he said.
The men escaped after the attack, and no one claimed responsibility for it, but Arab-language network Al-Jazeera said Taliban militants were suspected to be responsible.
The incident occurred about 8 a.m. near Mirwais Nika Girls High School in the Meir Weis Mena district.
Kandahar government spokesman Parwaz Ayoubi gave different figures on the number of girls injured, saying six were burned, one of them severely. He called the attackers "enemies of education."
Girls were forbidden to attend school under the Taliban, which ruled the country from 1996 to 2001, when U.S.-led forces removed them from power. Watch reaction to the attack from U.S. first lady Laura Bush »
According to Al-Jazeera, the girls were attacked with battery acid. Two teenage sisters, one of whom suffered serious burns, were among the victims.
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"We were on the way to school when two men on motorbikes stopped next to us. One of them threw acid on my sister's face. I tried to help her, and then they threw acid on me, too," Latefa, 16, told the Qatar-based satellite network.
"We were shouting, and people came to see what was going on. Then the two men escaped," she said.
Latefa told Al-Jazeera that she was hurt, and her 18-year-old sister was in serious condition with acid burns on her face.
Al-Jazeera said schoolgirls in Kandahar can be recognized by their uniform of black pants, white shirt, black coat and head scarf.
The top U.S. commander in Afghanistan condemned the incident, as well as a suicide bombing that occurred near a government building hours later that killed and wounded several civilians, including women and children.
"These cowardly acts reflect how dishonorable the insurgents truly are," Gen. David McKiernan said in a statement posted on the Web site of the International Security Assistance Force.
"No one can honestly say they are fighting for the people, then purposefully attack innocent women and children," he said.
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Are you kidding? Are we spending $100 billion a year and losing hundreds (and more than a thousand total) of soldiers for women's rights in Afghanistan? Are we spending $100 Billion a year to chase less than 100 Al Qaeda members while Yemen, Pakistan and lots of other "failed states" fester? Is it women's rights now and the Taliban suddenly or the new found mineral deposits or the possible re-emergance of Al Qaeda, or the poppy trade that will keep us re-enforcing failure in a failed strategy of COIN? It is lining the pockets of Nagl, Kilcullen and others while you are worried about the rights of women in Afghanistan all the while American soldiers and MArines are getting killed to protect the population of a country that no longer wants us around for a corrupt government that we are stuck with.
We have given them better infrastructure and better governing possibilities and a GDP that is 3 or 4 times greater than before we got there. We needed to defeat the Al Qaeda for 9-11 and show the world we were not going to take that EVER. Now lets get the Counter terrorism going and get Americans home as much as possible and protect the USA and maybe worry about our women and our economy and our borders while choosing our foriegn battles based on a NAtional interest and need as opposed to a choice.
Does the problem in Mexico worry you?
Women's rights in Afghanistan...tell that to the 58 American soldiers families who died last month.
It will be when they can take care of themselves!!! What ever they do after tht is up to them not us... As long as they don't let the enemy back in again!!!
If we wait for that to happen... We will never get the troops out of there!!!
I can't speak for all those in the military, but yes Afghanistan's women, children and weak are worth fighting and dying for. The cold tone sounds like someone who does not realize, or at the very least care, about some of the terrible things that happen in the parts of the world that are easy to ignore. American women and children? In the U.S. our quality of life is unbelievably high compared to the vast majority of the world, and if attempting to stop people who throw acid in the face of school girls gets me killed then so be it. I hope that if one day the U.S. is no longer the powerhouse of the world and similar crimes happen here that maybe a Chinese, British or w/e nationality soldier would risk their lives for our women and children.
exactly! if they think like you then we have the advantage! its called strategic thinking! use your brain before criticizing, this is why you are not our country's leader!
We do this, as a country, in order to convince the enemy our plans are to start pulling out. We are not that simple...just so you know
we need to continue doing what we've been doing. using complex strategy operations. but it would be good to also not announce them but to just do them. no one should claim victory because as you as you try to celebrate, the enemy will try a new thing–so better to just keep suppressing the enemy and remain reserved from each point of progress. I served in Afghanistan a year ago with the army national guard.
we need to remain steadfast.
We have to let them know that they have to work to learn... Because we will not be there for ever!!!
The US will not meet the 2011 deadline. They don't want to! They would like to keep troops in Afghanistan for as long as possible. The government should define success based on the fact that there has been no terrorist attack since Sept 11th 2010!
First off.. there have been attacks since 9/11 in other countries, just none successful in the U.S.. Second.. I believe the decline in successful attacks has been a direct result of our offensives in Iraq and more recently, Afghanistan. The Taliban are more focused on fighting the battle in their homeland rather than attacking ours. Although I do not agree with the war, I believe we are doing good by hindering the Taliban's ability to uncontestedly plan attacks on our beautiful homeland.
Seriously, the Taliban did not plan anything overseas. In 2001 we told the Taliban they could stay if they handed over UBL and the Al Qaeda folks. Oh by the way they planned the attacks in Germany and trained in Florida, not in Afghanistan. We are not stopping the underwear bombers (not from Afghanistan) or the Times Square car bomber (not from Afghanistan) or the Fort Hood shooter (Not from Afghanistan)...we are lucky so far and also our homeland security is far better and far more connected and communicating than pre-9-11.
$100 billion a year and more than a thousand dead. No defined end state, no objectives and no plan for how to get our soldiers home. What does a win look like? Are you prepared for it to take 10-20 more years and TRILLIONS of dollars? And what do we gain from it...more attacks like I listed above? the Afghan people don't want us around and don't care who we are...some of them still thought we were the Soviets last year when we showed up in a few secluded stone age villiages...What does it look like any better in 10 years than it does today?
Guiscard wrote: "The Taliban will be defeated, by the Coalition or others. Evil always declines and rots away. Afghanistan is an ecological disaster, with an 18% literacy rate. Root for the Ruslan, and join them in the irrelevance of their nasty brutish lives. Or hope the Coalition prevails and brings hope to these people that live in mud huts..."
"...by the coalition or others..." doubt in american victory? haha
Evil? Who decided what is evil and what and what is good? You? JW Bush? He is senile! Maybe because you are christian, that why you are good? And who killed 8 millions jews? Muslem or Christian? Who dropped nuclear bombs on Hirosima and Nagasaki? Who killed dozen of millions of native Indians in America? Who killed few millions Vietnam people? Who invade any country without permission? More examples?
Ecological disaster? What about oil in Gulf? What about ozone whole? More examples?
Illiteracy? And i suppose such people like you read only CNN and BBC. That is why are so erudite.
Mud huts? Why not invade Africa or Papua New Guinea. All people there live in mud huts. They are cologicaly clean. Go back to school, ignoramus, you are too boring.
That will only happen if the Republicans get control of the Congress and Senate... Otherwise we will get out as close to that time as we can!!!
Good job, Taliban!!! All people, who care about future and balance on this planet admire you! Last 40 years invaders and barbarians, like Russians and Americans (together with cowardly English and European allies) trying to destroy your life, culture, religion and you stand that all. It is amazing!!!!!!!!! Everything is on their side and they can't win: they have weapons, allies, propaganda, resourses – everything – and they are losing! It is incredible!!! I firmly believe – nothing can break you, Taliban! And i am preying for you every day! Please, please, kill so many aliens as possible!!!
You're an idiot. Go back to living under a rock, fool.
I concur with Steve...you are an idiot.
You sound like the enemy. If it weren't for the innocence people of these countries we could take them all out and without the needs for ground forces. I don't agree with this war, I believe it is going to end up like Vietnam, too many lives lost for people who hated us in the first place. Freedom & liberation come from within and the fact is people are going to die.
The Taliban will be defeated, by the Coalition or others. Evil always declines and rots away. Afghanistan is an ecological disaster, with an 18% literacy rate. Root for the Ruslan, and join them in the irrelevance of their nasty brutish lives. Or hope the Coalition prevails and brings hope to these people that live in mud huts...
Russia tried to take over the Country... We are trying to help them take control of it themselves!!! That is a big difference...
If the Taliban had turned over OBL and Al Qaeda after 9/11, the US would have had no reason to go into Afghanistan. Contrary to whatever propaganda you are being fed, there is nothing in that country that we want.
GET BACK WHERE YOU BELONG SATAN.
This war is a joke just as the iraq war through the civil war in america. This war is for global position for international bankers, oil men, and the imperialist nation that runs all in the global war for control of everything and everyone. God better bless the usa. Happy 5th of July
It is funny how we have help from other Countries in Afghanistan!!! But know help when it comes to Iraq...
You tell me that troop movement in this time of media can be kept secret? I don't think so. And we all know no matter what Obama says, the opposition will be against it. Gawd help the USA as the repubs continue to work against everything good or bad. Bring the troops home ASAP.
That is why we have to vote them out of office!!! So that the People can take the Country back...
Both the Iraq and Afghan wars are a waste of lives and money. We never should have started and we should get out ASAP. These efforts are doomed to failure. Both nations will return to the 13th Century as soon as we leave. They are hopelessly mired in corruption and ancient tribal hatreds. As for the war on terrorism it just needs good police work and an alert public. Cooperation with international intelligence services, infiltration of Islamic cells and organizations, following the money and internet traffic are all good things to do. But forget using armies on the ground. Its not that kind of war.
I guess WWII was a waste of lives too right???
yes i agree with both of you we should not give away our plans just liek they have taught me in law enforcment and now as i am apart of the military we do not give out vital information like that never. im so glad to see that people are expressing what they thinkand its great the more voices we get out there mabye our governemt might shut up and listen for once. and not think about them slefs and there job.
A state in which AQ is destroyed and the Taliban are no longer a threat to the Afghan Government.
The only way to make sure they don't come back is to make both Afghanistan and Pakistan strong enough to keep them out!!!
I agree with allamerican and more.
if our billions of dollars of intelligence tells us there is a threat we ought to reduce that threat.Use that money in addition to a new age of understanding.
End the Hatfield and McCoy feuds, that will be bloody days nut that is the direction we need to help them govern and control there issues.
We need to figure out new businesses besides drugs for their farmers, perhaps some hybrid goats, and I am not kidding. I the long run we need to setup permanent bases and civilian jobs, roads, natural resource harvests.. to benefit their country and investors.
Moneys for join training, police, interdiction, paramilitary and a better way of culture change. None of these will meet a 2011 exit schedule. Culture besides " Genocide". I DaSon'e predict it will takes tens of decades to change hundreds of years of female slavery.
They need leadership that is protected from suicide bombs. In fact we need a new high tech interdiction on that situation in pertinent.
lets us all pray to your own personnel god and thank you for riding planet earth"Human" for we know you and we have no other chose.
Firm, Fair, and Respect. Its' the old west their boys and girls that is what you need to understand. put out bounty for outlaws and have many Afghan and any one whom will be Afghan federal marshals. Incarcerate those Jesse James and AL Ca pones of their culture.
Set up this system and perhaps 10 to 15 years we will be able to see a better future for those afgans'
.In announcing a schedule will only play into the planning of those whom wish to
In last their world is our world. Isolation won't work.
Have Your Best Day Today, and Thank You for your Time.
Abbas to Arabs: We'd Support a War Against Israel
Israel National News Thu, 08 Jul 2010 08:54 AM PDT
Follow Israel news on and . Palestinian Authority Chairman Mahmoud Abbas told Arab leaders that the PA is ready to wage war on Israel if the rest of the Arab world does, according to the PA daily Al-Hayat al-Jadida as translated by Palestinian Media Watch.
Turkey again warns Israel over flotilla attacks
Middle East Online Thu, 08 Jul 2010 08:54 AM PDT
Turkish FM says Israel should accept accountability for deadly flotilla attack if it wants to improve ties with Turkey.
Israel National News Thu, 08 Jul 2010 08:53 AM PDT
The Ramallah-based Al-Quds , Al-Ayyam and the Al-Hayat al-Jadida were all stopped by Hamas from distributing their newspapers in Gaza this week. The newspapers were originally prevented from entering Gaza three years ago when Israel closed the crossings after Hamas seized control of the region.
I'll tell you right now for anyone who has served in either Iraq or Afghanistan they will all tell that we will never leave these two places. In afghanistan right now there are more civilian DOD contractors than military. There are many companies and lobbyists, and senators in Washington making millions of money of the contracts they are signing with the DOD. These people won't for this war to end, they are making too much money. This war isn't about terrorism or the Taliban anymore, it is about who in Washington could sign a company and make millions. Pres Obama, it'd be very wise of you cut these contracts and send these contractors home. Serving with civilans in a warzone feels dangerous. A military servicemember needs another servicemember for who he can trust, becuase these civilan contractors are not here to help in the fight but rather for the $15,000 (15 thousand) they are making every 2 weeks!
that's just it, we announce our plans, they come flocking to us rather than us having to go search for them
That's the idea get them all in the same place and hit them hard.
I work in the field of defense procurement and part of the job requires an in-depth knowledge of what war actually is, which by the way seems to be something that most Americans and most civilians seem to fundamentally misunderstand. War is not some computer game and it is nothing like how it is portrayed in movies or in the popular media. Everyone is a loser in war – hell, do the Americans here have any idea what percentage of their taxes go to funding military spending every year, of which almost 80% of it is complete waste (ex. $20,000 toilets and everything else that goes with my job)? We are not getting the best security for the money – Congress knows it and so do our private military industrial firms. Victory, in the sense that American's will somehow see a benefit from this war, will never happen. This is just common business sense.
The Americans are not liberators and they never were. We have always been conquerors there. Our vested interests, as Americans, are a stable Afghanistan from which to extract its natural resources – that is it. Building a democracy in Afghanistan and Iraq is about making itnernational corporations more established there. We will not see a victory in this war because Afghanistan will not become a stable democracy and any sensible government would have to immediately declare martial law when the US leaves – its borders are far from secure and ethnic conflicts are bound to take place.
At this point, victory demands building the capacity of Afghan citizens to nonviolently organize (satisfies peace activists), securing the Afghan borderlands (satisfies the left), and capturing Osama Bin Laden (to please right-wing pundits). Afghanistan will be site of the next big genocide irregardless. The civilians are protesting our presence. Once they take to the streets, victory in this sense will also be impossible.
Very will put!!! Thanks...
Since those of you who have replied are not actually here and I am, you might be amazed to learn that this is a great policy "to pre-announce" your intention to invade. Several important things happen. 1) the innocent (wives, children, disabled, and men dedicated to their families above all else) LEAVE, and 2) those who really need to get blown up fortify their positions in the villages. That makes selecting a target much easier when the invasion is underway.
War is hell... But someone has to do it!!! If you want freedom...
We are waging this war all wrong. They fight with guirilla tactics. So should we. The war is becoming more and more unpopular with American people so lets have less troops on the ground but more effective troops. I say we need to focus everything into building a stable government with out Karzi who is corrupt, training a well armed army and police force, focus on job creation, building schools, and roads. Between now and the deadling we need search and destroy missions. We need use guirilla tactics like that do with us. After July 11 we pull out our troops and replace them with afghany troops. Meanwhile I think we need to still have a military presence on the ground invisible to both the enemy and the American people. I believe we need to use more drone planes to find targets of opportunity as well as manned aircrapft, every inch of that ground should be watched, we have the technology to do it, as well as find Taliban hide outs, we alert special forces teams already hiding in the country and destroy the enemy. We need to burn those poppy seed crops down and therefore put a choke hold on Taliban resources. Have them plant a commodity and we can subsidize partially what they would have made from the poppy plants like we do ethinol. So we will still be killing Taliban but won't be on the front page of the news and weighing on the minds of the American people.
The way Bush jr was the wrong way... I liked it better the way Bush Sr did it!!! But this way will keep the Enemy out of the Countries...
Due to the amount of troops in the region a coordinated withdrawal is required which itself requires a timeline that's impossible to keep underwraps. Shear panic will insue if we tried to just "pick up and leave". Remember it's not as if we're leaving a country at peace with a stable gov't, economy, and citizens who have a vested interest in the idea of democracy. This if afghanistan afterall and 9 months after we're out it'll be 1996 all over again. The old adage that those who do not learn from history are destined to repeat it holds true yet again.
That is not true!!! Why do you think we are taring them rather than take over Their Country??? This way they can do it by themselves!!!
That is your opinion!!! If you are wrong it won't hurt anyone... But if the President doesn't do what is right he gets the blame for it!!! Talk is cheap...
REPLY TO ALL AMERICAN. YOU ARE 100% CORRECT. I AGREE