it was a poor word choice. but a democratic form of representation, or even the ability to work as a government.
The basis of the Afghan "Government" is still mainly subject to demographics. Pashtun being the majority ethnicity, with Durrani Tribe being the largest Pashtun tribe, means Karzai is the President.
so, let me get this straight. you berate Larry for being a supposed "racist", then make a policy of "lets just drop bombs on it. that'll make it better". That mentality is what spawns even more terrorists. If you're looking for a cost-effective way we could just turn it into a parking lot.
Oh, and the reason our economy is in the crapper is not because we are a war economy, but because we exported all of our industries to cheaper countries to help with the owners bottom line.
*falls over laughing* Like he did in Iraq?
It just shows what kind of Racist you really are... It is to bad all you see if things going wrong... Instead of the good being done!!!
Larry, the real racist is perhaps somebody like you, since you have been brainwashed to believe the ' Yank way ' is the only and the best way there is on this planet. You might not realize it, but the USA is a broke war economy needing conflicts on a regular basis to create jobs in form of military personnel and weapon manufacturing . Do a search in how many countries in the world the USA has military bases and compare that with other countries. You might be surprised. These bases are not all there because the Americans have been invited by the population there , that's for sure unless you consider Kharzei' s request to invade his country the real thing. It doesn't matter at all how much good you think personally the USA is doing in Iraq or in Afghanistan. You can not transplant American, British or French mentality into Afghan brains. It s a huge mistake to believe that is possible.
If you would put it to a vote in these countries America would be asked to pack all their fancy weaponry and leave tomorrow , that's the reality American politicians would never dare to put to the test for obvious reasons.
We should all take our soldiers home to secure the borders of our own countries. Taking the war to the 'enemy's" territory is a very controversial idea. If in the future there is evidence of certain training camps in these countries put the biggest mother of all bombs on the place. That is much more effective than having 100 000 soldiers running around the country trying to make friends with people who really don't appreciate you.
We need to get the H.. out of there and bring all of our troops home ASAP
We will when the time is right... This time we will be able to keep the tarriest out because of the right training of Their Troops and Police!!!
He will not succeed similar as the Russians did not succeed years earlier with very capable Generals in charge. How come, nobody gets it ? The people in that region do not only want foreigners running around their backyards heavily armed for so many years, they don't want foreigners there no matter what. Full-stop. Its their total right. It does not help that the US installs a US financed so called government there costing billions, who then in turn asks officially for help from the US. People are very different in these areas of the world but they are definitely not stupid and they know how to fight invaders. No way the US plus cronies is going to win that war, just because there is another General in charge, no matter how sympathetic he appears to be. The main reason why we wont succeed is that we lost all sympathy and friends in that region and this you can't buy back there with bullets, bombs, bribery and sweet talk. For some strange reason putting napalm on all the poppy fields to neutralize the enemy's single biggest financial support is out of the question. It would be fairly easy to do but at least on the surface it looks like somebody needs that opium badly and its not only the Afghanies.
There is a big difference from how we are doing it and Russia did it!!! We will succeed because we are training them bot trying to take them over...
We should be supporting Our Troops both in Afghanistan and Iraq!!! We should also be supporting the Vets and their Family now they are home... The only way we will ever get anything done is by Voting the Republicans out of office!!!
Where do pharmaceutical companies get opiates for their drugs?
ronnie, also thank you for your service. I am truly proud to be an American for those who fought before me, and those who will continue the fight long after i'm gone.
DAVE AS A FELLOW WAR VET. I THANK YOU DEARLY FOR SERVING BECAUSE I BACK ANY VETERAN 100 %. I LIKE TO LEARN ABOUT WARS I'VE NOT BEEN IN,BUT IF I WASN'T IN MY 60'S I'D BE WITH YOU'LL.I PRAY THAT THE GOVERMENT WILL UNTIE YOU ALL'S HANDS AND LET THE COMMANDERS DO THEIR JOB THERE.GOOD LIKE IN YOUR DEPLOYMENT DAVE & MAY 'GOD' PUT HIS SAFETY NET OVER EACH OF YOU THERE & IRAQ.THANK YOU AGAIN.'GOD' BLESS AMERICA & IT'S SOLDIERS.
Ronnie, i believe we are in Afghanistan to avenge those 3,000 deaths. The attack on September 11th was a key proponent to our assault on, and destruction of the old taliban regime that was in power in Afghanistan. If the Bush administration had done nothing against this attack on our soil it would have been political suicide (note he was re-elected) had we sat back and done nothing it would have shown the international community that the US was a giant push-over. The Iraq war was just a sidebar, a father-son passing of the hat if you will.
I am a United States marine, been one for nearly 5 years now. Have done tours in Iraq and soon Afghanistan. I do agree with your argument that Afghanistan will never truly grasp democracy, nor will it ever hold it dear to themselves, but i must disagree with your argument that Hamid Karzai wasn't elected. (side note: Ayad Alawi, former US appointed PM for the Iraqi transitional government, had a pretty high yield in Iraqs last election, and Karzai was re-elected as president of Afghanistan most likely due to his tribal background as a durrani)
– Larry, Bush had US forces slated to leave Iraq during the same time table Obama agreed with, and followed through with. I still haven't seen Oil prices come down, so i still don't believe the idea that it was for oil. (if so we kinda screwed ourselves over, don't you think?)
Can you define what you mean by "democracy" here?
I do agree with your argument that Afghanistan will never truly grasp democracy, nor will it ever hold it dear to themselves, but i must disagree with your argument that Hamid Karzai wasn't elected.
How do you expect anyone to do it when the United States hasn't even done it yet???
Dave: Bush could have finish the war with in one week if He didn't pull the troops out when he did!!! The only reason we went back with Bush Jr. was the oil!!!
Do you need to bribe the police where you live?
Obama is trying to get both Countries to be able to take care of themselves!!! Not like Bush and Chenney that when Iraq for the oil...
on the discussion of targetting Osama i'd direct you to ghost wars. also, within the pages of this book you may find the early sparks of the war in afghanistan... Ronnie – the thought of building a US run pipeline for oil through the silk road is absurd. That, and where exactly would we have directed it to? Pakistan? Iran? I doubt the validity of that statement.
dave then why are we in iraq & afghanistan to avenge the death of 3,000 people ? we and other countries or allies will loose a hell of a lot more than that and these people will never stop killing or be killed.they will run us out like they have been other invaders for over a thousand years and they will never except a democracy.like david koresh at waco the fbi could have got him in waco and the same with osama bin laden, but the u.s. gov. wants to be the big dog in the world.i love this land thats why i went to the army and war,but if your not a combat veteran stay away from cnn and go there and get the real truth,you want get it here.in hitlers mein kamp "HE SAYS IF YOU TELL THE PEOPLE A LIE LONG ENOUGH THEY WILL BEGIN TO BELEIVE IT." WHY NOT FOR OIL.
Yes, The General Petraeus would succeed the war if he finds a right exit strategy from this country. He was said an architect of war in Iraq bringing down all violences in 2007. I think that the real success of war is to bring peace, prosperity, stability to its people. Simply, the General should have a clear message to Afghan people that " we, Americans, come here is to help you that Afghan people and other human beings need and get a better life. We, Americans, will leave, with no ambitions to occupy the country, Afghanistan once the Afghan government can be assured the full responsibility of its own securiy.
Can anyone explain the border difference between these two tabs (Afghanistan vs. Iraq). Note that all of the casualties from Iraq are inside of the US border. Switch to the Afghan tab, Afghanistan includes Canada. Why? What interests are being protected with such clear distinctions between the two?
The difference is Iraq never attacked us!!! We are there for the oil... Afghanistan and Pakistan is where they are training the Tarriest to kill Our People!!!
LarryValencia,CA: His case was pretty bad. He was below his birth weight and had lost his sucking reflex. They said that was the last to go on babies. I found a breast cancer. It's an odd thing, but you lose your friends when you get cancer. (People that you thought were your friends just disappear.) One person was there for me with the very best quality information. He was Jewish. I will never forget that guy. I worked with people that are Muslims...very nice people. Honestly, I really liked all of the people that I met from multiple cultures. Korea, Phillipines, India. Many have been through wars, and that's why they are here. I've met some women that probably need to be pulled forward, but they were in school so I would imagine they will get there. That's just it...we work, go to school, and even play with people from all over the world now. I have a hard time with the concept of war. It's just too extreme for me. I know too many people that have been through wars. There's something wrong with this picture.
It doesn't stop there. I met kids from Nicaragua at school. Chile. Pakistan. Russia. All had been affected by war. Except India, and recently we have had physicians that were very distraught about what happened in Kashmir. It's too much. Do you see that? It's too much war. There's something wrong with this picture. In my lifetime, I have met too many people that have been through war. Their families are all messed up because they are dispersed all over the planet.
I meant Bribe, not a bride! DOH.... LOL
No we will never see what we call Democracy in this country. Corruption is to ingrained in their culture. What we call a bride they call just doing business. You cannot get an alcoholic to stop drinking by telling them drinking is bad. It's like they have been drinking before we got there and will be after they leave. This is a HUGE waste of my tax dollars. Thanks GWB & the Republican's, who should we invade next so the defense lobby can ask for more weapons system for that war too!
We should support all those that ever fought to make this Country free!!! I'm a veteran myself... There are still to many Vietnam Vets that are homeless... Over 20,000 of them!!!
It's crazy. Please watch this video...it helped me understand a LOT. A LOT of what we were taught was wrong. She will start to explain it here, but the books are much more in depth.
Thank you for your service (although from the sounds of it you were a draftee and not a volunteer), UBL (Usama Bin Ladin) has committed to attack Americans on US and foreign soil. President Clinton tried to have him killed for his terrorist actions and affiliations but alas he failed. In Sep 2001 members of his group at his behest attacked the WTC killing 3,000 innocent American civilians. We are there to finish something that should have been done over a decade ago. There are many difference between Afghanistan and Vietnam one being Vietnamese terrorists didn't attack civilians on US soil.
You sir, have obviously not traveled to the middle east. Let me share a story. when I was in Iraq we worked at lot of this small Iraqi Army (IA) base and there were a couple of dogs living there. All the soldiers played with the dogs, feed them and we had nick names for them. The IA soldiers routinely threw rocks at the dogs so the dogs hated them. Apparently one day one of the dogs bit an IA soldier. So their commander went to ours and said they needed to kill the dog. he asked the commander to tell the soldiers not to protect the dog from the IAs. So the US commander agreed thinking they would shoot the dog in the head. Instead they stoned the dog until he was incapacitated then tied him to a truck and drove around the base with him dragging behind. Not all people are the same.
What else can you expect from a People that chop the heads of the People they capture!!!
I spent a good portion of my life thinking that dogs had more rights than I do as a woman. This country isn't as far advanced as one would like to think.
REASON WERE IN AFGHANISTANS. JUNE 5- A 1998 MEMO WRITTEN BY AL-QAIDA MILITARY CHIEF MOHAMMED ATEF REVEALS THAT OSAMA BIN LADEN HAD KNOWLEDGE OF NEGOTIATIONS THAT AMERICAN & TALIBAN LEADERS REJECTED THAT AMERICA COULD NOT BUILD OIL PIPE LINES ACROSS THEIR COUNTRY.THE E-MAIL MEMO WAS FOUND IN 1998 ON A COMPUTER SEIZED BY THE FBI .WHEN THE NEGOTIATIONS FAILED THE BUSH WHITE HOUSE THEN THERE WOULD BE MILITARY REPRISALS AGAINST THE TALIBAN FOR NOT GOING ALONG WITH AMERICAN DEMANDS.IT SHOWS AL-QAIDA'S KEEN INTEREST IN THE U.S.-TALIBAN NEGOTIATIONS AND RAISES NEW QUESTIONS AS TO WHETHER THE U.S. MILITARY THREAT TO THE TALIBAN IN JULY 2001 COULD HAVE PROMPTED AL-QAIDA'S SEPT.11 ATTACK.SO PEOPLE THINK WHY WE GO TO OTHER COUNTRIES , WE HAVE TO HAVE THEIR RESOURCES TO KEEP LIVING THE AMERICAN DREAM. IF I DON'T HAVE IT LETS GO TO ANOTHER COUNTRY AND START A WAR & TAKE IT. BY THE WAY I'M A VIETNAM DISABLED VET. & I FOUGHT IN A WAR LIKE THE ONES NOW EXCEPT WE FOUGHT IN THE JUNGLE. PRESIDENT JUST WAVE THE FLAG AND TELL US WERE BEING THREATENED OF OUR WAY OF LIFE & WE'LL GO KILL & DIE FOR A PURPOSE, OH YEAH I FORGOT THE GOVERMENT SAID WHY. ( REALLY ) THANK YOU. BEFORE YOU WRITE RESEARCH THE HISTORY OF THOSE 2 COUNTRIES.
I think we all human beings in this planet are confronted with violant nature and in this new millinium talks of a world as a global village, make us understand that our survival in this universe depend on our unity as human beings nothing else. Rapid climatic changes, disease and rising temprature of the planets leave little to think for our countries, religions, nations, race, color or regions as these can simply turn our attention from our eternal safety and security in this univers. Just imigine how we are helpless before these hurricans, tornidos, earth quakes and deadly diseases because most of our energies are being wasted in mutual confrontations and spend our resources in weapons production and fightings. Internet has already made the World a village. Let us share efforts and save each other like one family. This is our ultimate destination for us as a human beings.
Sure Petreaus will succeed. How hard is it to order heroin loaded onto a C-130 anyway? Petreaus will do great.
I'm sorry...my son's heart surgeon was from Iran. One from Iran, and one from Mexico. I didn't have time to discuss his religion or political views very much right there. I have a hard time believing the blanket statements that I read about whole groups of people sometimes. It doesn't fit for me.
I don't question for a minute that there are people living in a different century in the world. I'm just not convinced that I like the way people are treating each other.
It sounds like the Surgery was a success??? Thank GOD for that... I'm Jewish and I know all Muslin aren't bad!!!
Can Patraeus make Israel safe in the middle east (on tax dollars from the US)? Probably not. Cut the losses. Call it a day. Before they bankrupt US.
We are not fighting to make Israel safe... That is their job!!! We are fighting to keep American and other Countries Safe!!! Why do you think NATO is fighting with us???
Succeed in Afghanistan in what exactly?
Giving Hamid Karzai and the Karzai Clan Billions of taxpayer dollars using a shadow Pentagon-CIA fund thru a Dubai bank? YES, the Pentagon has certainly succeeded in fooling the American people while giving enormous amounts of American taxpayer provided CASH to the Karzai Clan.
Succeed in making Afghanistan the 53rd. State of America? NO, Hamid Karzai was not even democratically elected. He was hand-picked by the CIA to become the President of Afghanistan. Many countrys around the world along with the citizens of Afghanistan realize the recent Presidential election in Afghanistan was a sham and stolen by Hamid Karzai. Hamid Karzai is a dictator, supported only by America's machine guns upon the poor people of Afghanistan.
Succeed in flooding the world with Opium-Heroin? YES, during the Bush-Cheney administration, all 37 provinces across Afghanistan were fully planted with Opium Poppys resulting in an enormus spike in Opium-Heroin exports by the Karzai Clan to the world. Now Afghanistan produces 98% of the entire world's total of Opium-Heroin.
What you people forget Obama did not start the wars... He is just trying to finish it so it won't end up like Bush Sr war and we would have to go back and finish it!!!
People seem to have very short memories about the Bush-Cheney Wars ! I wish our soldiers could be living the life of luxury and sleeping like a baby like Bush-Cheney are !! Only the devil himself could not feel guilty about starting this war based on LIES !! Get our soldiers out of there N O W !!!
All he has to do is hire McCrystal to run it for him.
I'm still at a loss as to why we're in the Middle East... Wait, let me rephrase that... I'm still at a loss as to why people think we're in the Middle East. We're not there to combat terrorism. We're making it worse. In both cases we've whacked the hornet's nest and now we stand there wondering why the hornets sting.
Musharraf and Karzai are pawns of the forces we're supposedly fighting. Never mind the hearts and minds of the people of Afghanistan, that's just not going to happen. Not only are we strangers in a strange land, we're walking around with guns. If I walk up to you covered in body armor with an automatic weapon strapped to my chest and ask, "Will you be my friend?" my answer is likely to be, "Yes. Yes, I will." And I might be as likely to tell the guy whose got a gun strapped to his chest, but who shares my language and religion, just where that stranger went.
The situation in Afghanistan exists because there is no centralized government. There really never has been, and one will likely never exist. We can't look at this in terms of winning or losing. Instead, we have to look at it from the standpoint of leaving the hornet's nest alone and slowly walk away. Will they claim victory? You bet. But in the rear view mirror of Hummers across the region, we can see Al Qaeda and the Taliban shaking their fists saying, "And stay out!" Leaving our troops to come home and defend America for a change, not trying to feed millions of people something they find utterly impalatable: Good ol' Western-style democracy.
Adam,that's easy.We're in the Middle East to build an invisible empire and satisfy Barack Obama's vendetta against Islam.
You know, Onesmallvoice, if we'd gotten there last year, I might grant you a feeble argument. But we've been there for nearly ten years. Now, as for the whole invisible empire thing, that can bear some weight.
No in the rear view mirror of our HMMWV's we'll see Al Qaida obtaining passports to the US to follow us. Bin Ladin has vowed to fight us anywhere we are. It doesn't matter whether we take our troops home or not. You're views are short sighted and unfortunately the shared by many ignorant Americans. You should have a sit down with a soldier and see what he/she thinks.
Is Bin Laden even alive? Do you really trust the "once in a blue moon" videos of him?
Iraq for the oil... Afghanistan to stop Tarriest!!!
Remember Vietnam, If not I do. For those who don't remember the past, are doomed to repeat it.
I also remember that Vietnam is a different country. Those who compare different civilizations are forever ignorant.
If they would have left the troops to the Generals rather than listen to Congress, Senate and UN... We would have won that war too!!!
Our focus should be on Iran, not Afganistan, because Iran poses as our biggest threat to our national security with the development of nuclear warheads. Our leaders better get the blinders off their face before it is too late.
We are ready have two wars to fight... Israel will take care of Iran especially the way Iran is acting towards Israel!!!
Not if he doesn't change the strategy and curb the ridiculous rules of engagement.
It sure didn't work Bush's way... At least Obama way we have a chance in both Countries!!!
The current ROE's in Afghanistan were first implemented by McChrystal in 2009.
If he does,he may just become the next Dwight D.Eisenhower on the horizon and then I'll vote for him whenever he runs for the presidency and then we'll have our most glorious empire and have struck a mighty blow to Islam at the same time!
Hey Gary,what did the Moslims ever do to you???
Gary == STUPID + IDIOT !!!
Can't you see that he is being sarcastic?
Have you already forgotten about 9/11? It's what they did to this country!
learn to spell before you criticize someone!
Right now this war is a greatest blow to all the TAX payers funds. I wonder why we have to be in Afghanistan to defend USA? Why dont we invest those billions in our Navy and Airforce and Border security instead of building roads in Afghanistan?
Afghanistan has always been a problem. it is a terrorist hot bed and has been home to training camps for decades. if we want terrorists to stop training there we need to establish a government that won't allow that, people who see more value in living than dying, and an economy that all in the country can benefit so terrorism isn't an attractive offer.
CB Calif: You can not blame all Muslin for 9/11!!! The reason we are fighting there is to free the Afghanistan People from these Tarriest!!!
So they can't train there Tarriest to come to the United States to kill us!!!
That was perfect. Well said. That's exactly what needs to happen.
Sam you make an excellent point. Instead of fighting in other countries that's costing the US billions, we should be beefing up our borders.
Larry, come on now, be smart. How can the terrorist come to the US if we have done what Sam suggest? Free Afghanistan? Really? You must not have been watching the news. Does trillions of dollars of untapped mineral resources ring a bell?
I'm with you!!! This whole deal of protecting people who would rather see us dead anyway is for the birds. Bring our troops home and defend our country in our country!!!!!!
THERE IS NO WAY THAT ANYONE CAN SUCCEED THERE AND WE NEED TO GET OUT OF THERE AND BRING ALL OF OUR TROOPS HOME ASAP....
If Bush would still be President he wouldn't... But with Obama as President he has a good chance of doing it!!! Unless the Republicans stop him from doing it...
Afghanistan Crossroads is where CNN's reporting converges -- bringing you a diversity of voices, stunning images and video, global perspectives and the latest news from on the ground in Afghanistan and around the world.
- This blog was archived in October 2011.
From all parts of the world and spanning all ages, more than 2,500 U.S. and coalition troops have died in Afghanistan.
Explore the names, ages and faces of the fallen